The Huddle - Episode 147 - Blueprint to Success: Collaborating with Architects and Designers

This week on The Huddle, Paul, Daniel, and Jose dive into what it really takes to build strong relationships between flooring installers and the design world. From architects to interior designers, these partnerships are key to smoother installs, better projects, and long-term success. Whether you’re looking to grow your business or improve communication on the jobsite, this episode is packed with insight and real-world advice to help you stand out and become the installer architects want to work with again and again.

💡 What You’ll Learn in This Episode: Building successful collaborations with architects and designers—a key strategy for flooring installers and companies looking to elevate their business. You’ll learn the importance of communication, product knowledge, and being seen as a trusted expert in the A&D (Architecture and Design) community. The conversation also highlights real-world examples of navigating specs, offering value-engineered alternatives, and educating clients on proper maintenance. Whether you're an installer or a contractor, this episode equips you with actionable insights to differentiate yourself in a competitive market.

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The Huddle Podcast is where the flooring industry comes together to connect, learn, and thrive! Recognized as the #1 podcast in the flooring community, we provide an unmatched platform for professionals to discuss everything from installation techniques to industry trends.

At The Huddle, we’re all about driving Forward Progress—empowering seasoned installers, contractors, and flooring enthusiasts to grow, innovate, and lead in their craft. Whether you’re looking for real conversations, actionable insights, or inspiration to take your career to the next level, The Huddle is your home for real discussions that matter.

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Please visit our new website! https://thehuddle.team

what is up guys Welcome to the huddle We're here to give the installer a voice

and make sure you're equipped to win with everything you need in the current market environment To all our new

viewers welcome to the team Well it looks like we are shy uh

one of the uh major contributors today It's only me

and Jose but Daniel is trying to join I know that for a fact He was on a little

bit earlier We were dealing with a little bit of technical difficulties trying to get the streaming up and

running So fun fun Uh issues on the other platforms almost

episode 300 by now I think And we just you know you got to deal with this stuff

every week So what's up Mr Jose What's going on brother

Well you know trying to make the trying trying to hang on while the world turns

Yeah Yeah Yeah it is spinning pretty fast How's life How's uh how's Michigan

Uh the weather is finally breaking We've got consistent warm days We're outside

playing baseball Um everybody's outside playing baseball Uh in better weather

Uh that grass is finally starting to to grow a little bit getting green getting

all those nice dandelions in the in the grass and reminding myself how I don't have time to go

fertilize and get my my my yard to par but that's all right

Well um I'm just glad to see you brother I'm glad you

uh could make it today as usual I I shouldn't even say that You guys are I'm

turning on trying to turn on a couple of sharing things here myself but you guys

are always here and so I'm hoping to delay far or long enough here

to get your brother on But today's uh podcast for our viewers is building a blueprint to success collaborating with

architects and I believe it's general contractors as well Um so this is something that I love

doing Um if you guys uh want to get going in the chat ask any

questions I do a lot of this uh specifically with architects and designers So got a lot of experience

here I know you guys uh Jose and and Daniel uh do as well We're gaining We're

gaining more We're gaining more You definitely uh your experience is definitely leaps and bounds above what

we have but we're learning Well it's uh it's the secret It's one of the secrets

to this business So if you're a flooring company I give you some of my secrets

and uh it's it is what it is That's what this podcast is for But if you're an

installer you can get a good insight on how uh you might be able to do this as well

Um a lot of this um a lot of the success that comes from working with architects

designers general contractors um specifically architects and designers

is listening Really listening and then understanding understanding them Uh so

that you know you don't um we all have a little bit of ego in us and if you go to

college for a few years to get a design degree you want to have your your

selections protected and and have your you know your uh have your uh opinions

valued and things like that Uh I think we all want that Uh but it is one of the

keys to success when working with a a uh a a architect

Hey hey what's up Daniel He's back Can you hear us Yeah I had to quit

everything and then reopen it All right Are you back for good I hope

so It just kept on kicking me off randomly so we'll see what happens

All right Well I was just saying what our topic is Thanks uh for joining brother We was talking about the weather

a little bit doing a little bit of uh little bit of delaying seeing if we can

get you on here Yeah All right Well audience uh

participate today If you want to know some uh if you have any questions about working with architects designers even

general contractors uh I I would say this this panel has a pretty dog on deep

knowledge of that And uh I view it as one of

the differentiators for us and our our uh competition is working with

architects and designers in particular and and being able to uh you know understand like I was telling Jose

earlier their quirks and you know what what drives them and what they're really looking for and uh that's different I

mean if you're dealing with general contractor and you give them price and schedule you you win the day uh

architects and designers a little bit different and uh they want they're budget conscious a lot of times but

they're also much more uh we've done work directly with them uh directly with

architects and designers and they're more like driven by the uh end result um

they leave that pricing stuff for general contractors So if you can work direct or do some specifications

uh working with the designer early um on a set on a project it is a real uh

differentiator and can add a little bit better margin to your uh to your

projects as well So yeah be being requested and having let's say having

your foot in the door um because of of what you provide the solutions you

provided in the past is is phenomenal It's a great relationship Yeah Essentially if you're

taking the place of your spe your your uh sales reps and you're specifying

product for them and you're literally placing their products on

projects you're doing their job So they're willing to give you brought the project to them So they're willing to

give you uh a better price if you you can pass on all that price or you can

pass on some of that price I suggest some of it uh not all of it and make

yourself a better margin Um and frankly uh when you're dealing

with uh architects designers I'll just say the A andd community from here on

when you're dealing with the A andd community you're you you have um in many

ways put yourself in a position where you have to think like them and really be cognizant of that that desired look

So you're you know how when we bid a set of drawings what's the what's the worst thing you come across Daniel when you

see a set of drawings and something's not clear

Everything Everything I was going to see what you would say but I I I really

despise that wasn't the intent or design intent on a set of drawings And in the

specs and the on the print it will say do whatever one is like refer to this

one for the right one but then most of the time neither of them are right anyways Yeah Yeah Or or when it says um

you know if there's a discrepancy between the specs and the drawings or something of that nature it'll say uh or

in any of this documentation that you should assume the greater of the two Well you're going to just price yourself

right out of a job You get to collaborate more when you're dealing directly with the A&D community as

opposed to working through a general contractor because a GC wants to keep it peaches to peaches You know he wants to

know he's comparing the same that you're looking at the same way

someone else is so he can you know he or she can uh accurately assess the bidding

Um if you're doing a a lot of design work or a lot of uh

specifying you're kind of stepping in that that position and you can collaborate more with them You can ask

them hey what are you wanting to do here I'm working on a a nice project right now And man it's it's kind of fun It's

always I've always enjoyed it This one in particular is fun It's a little upper

end of a of a uh multifamily and upper end Fancy Yeah You

know you know what multifamily brings a lot of times Well this is uh this is more for it's in a college town and it's

more for the you know um it's more for the parents or something like that than

the students And um people who pay the bills I got you You got to attract That's who you got to attract Yeah So

it's it's been a really fun project to be involved with The the designers been

super awesome And uh at the end of the day you know when you put in that kind

of work you you hope to because you're doing so much more than just bidding a project Uh you can make better margins

and you get to work through a lot of the little discrepancies You know a lot of

times when I'm bidding a job and I I'd love to hear your take on this too Daniel but if I don't have if I can just pick

up the phone and talk to the art the the designer and know what they want as

opposed to having to go through this RFI system So it's always apples to apples Oh my goodness If you can just pick up

that phone and say "Hey at at the end of this corridor where the carpet tile ends

at the stairs what are you wanting to do there?" Or whatever the scenario Um what I I have been on a project

before where it was like going on and on and on and it was like man I'm spending

so much time on just submitting this stuff And they were like hey well the the architect's actually going to be

here on this day at this time I said me too And it's crazy the amount that can

get accomplished just in that short conversation Yeah instead of having to submit something waiting a I mean

between you know a couple days and a couple weeks sometimes for them to get back to you Yeah especially around

spring break Oh my goodness was that not was that a bad time to have bids due

It's been busy for sure Um you know K keeping with the blue if we were to

build build a blueprint as the title says of to success for these

collaborations I would probably start at knowing your

product really knowing and having a a vast knowledge of different product

lines whether it's in the sheet vinyls the LVTs the tiles all the different product lines because once they look at

you once the A and D community kind of um uh visualizes or you know looks at

you as the expert man the the calls just come through the they they they want to

work with you because they know that you're going to put the right product in the right locations Um and then you

start to get you know kind of some owner confluence as well where hey you did this one before with me on the with this

owner What do you think he'll like on this scenario And those are just that's just a great position to be in other

than just hard bidding Now I'm not I don't do enough

residential How do you guys deal with the A andd community or the design community in the residential world Do

you guys get into that Uh no not really I mean the the majority

of the residential that we do is already on existing projects existing homes Um as far as having relationships with

builders um we're with the builder direct It's not necessarily with uh A&D

And the builder is going to lead their architect their designer in in a

specific direction based off information that that we give them But we still have to start with all the spec materials Uh

but we don't do like any spec homes or anything like that Um like I said everything is kind of direct Uh a lot of

custo custom stuff and they're pretty wide open It's a blank blank canvas Well

what do you recommend This is what color we want This is kind of what material we

want What do you why haven't you guys gotten in touch with like some of the higherend designers for residential

stuff and and chatted with them and started forming relationships with them

Um I've 100% tried I went to the was it called the home and whatever shows I

know that we had talked about that with uh uh Elizabeth was on on the podcast I went there and tried to make connections

um it seems that they already have like their core group and it's hard for them to veer away from it So all I ask for is

hey if you ever have any issues or or you're in a bind give me a call see if we can help you out Um

but it's hard to get in there because typically they have a favorite that they

work with that kind of gives them pricing They've already specked material they don't want to veer from the normal

and um but that's only a handful You know at this point I think I'm making an

excuse on why we haven't when I know there's a couple dozen uh out there around us So I guess

uh I'm too lazy That's the way it is I'm too lazy And I'll be honest I just don't

want to get into that much residential Yeah Well I mean we were talking about

commercial and that's by far I think both of our you know bread and butter and what we really love doing But when I

do a residential I either I I like to bring in a designer sometimes even if

I'm dealing with a homeowner because they they just they like to see

that you know those couple of all the pieces put together before they

start actually putting them deals and they like to see that little degree at the end of the name

And it it helps with getting product through because I'll deal with the designer and I'll work with her and say

"Hey this is what I think we ought to put there Pick a color." And then it's a lot easier sell if you have a a designer

that you do work with I have one I do a ton of work with um at a local

manufacturing plant And I mean we've done everything from epoxy coatings to

uh in pro wall panels to like and it's just they have a problem they go to her

for a solution She comes to me for the solution I give her samples chain sets of stuff that I think

will uh really address those things that they want to address whatever whether

it's wearability or a certain look they're trying to um and I'll do the research We're doing uh wall panels Um

and we had started doing impro wall panels a while while back Um but we

started doing started looking at uh acoustical wall panels and there's this Lux wall that we and there's other

brands but Lux Wall is the one we ended up going with and it's L U X E W A L and

it's an acoustical wood visual and uh we're getting ready

to do a bunch of that for them because in their new facility we put a bunch of Milicanin LBT in

And um but they're big open rooms so there's no acoustical uh ceilings It's

all open and so it's kind of echoey And so we're putting these these really cool

looking wall panels everywhere Well that's not something I would have done if I wasn't dealing directly with a

designer you know I mean you just I I may have done the wall panel install or

bid it but I would have been hard bitten against somebody It's just a different world and you find new products you know

I also like being challenged you know hey we're looking for this something

that's going to you know look awesome match our uh decor match our overall

design in in the in the facility but be acoustical at the same time So it was

fun just finding the product putting the the the parts and pieces together and then you know putting the numbers

together got accepted and boom start next week Boom Shakaaka There you go

Creating solutions That's that's what I have find a hard time doing is being the actual designer when it comes to stuff

right cuz I just bid one and got the contract for um the our local county and

they're like this is what we want You just provide us with whatever you you want to do And it's like man I have such

a hard time doing this right but it's just like you see the a lot of these architectural firms and they do a lot of

the the same products on multiple different jobs So you can oh it's this

product I know who who the architect is basically And I think it's all based on uh whoever has visited their office most

recently probably because I mean it's all in relationships right Because there's been times where some of our

sales reps come in here and it's like "Oh you know what I'm I am looking at a job right now and this is what we need So let me get some pricing for that."

Yeah Yeah That's a good point when you've worked with when you've been in the business long enough and you got

some uh uh you've got you know some some

experience with a particular A and D firm and then you get an owner who's

like and you know that they've worked together in the past You're like "Ah I know what I can I know what I can show

you." Yeah I actually enjoy that part It's something I I really like doing and

I'm no I'm not a designer but I've just been doing this so long that I've got a feel for what looks good together

Although you know some people might question that but for the most part I

feel like I got a pretty good taste in that stuff And and uh all you need is a couple of architects or a couple of

designers couple architects to really have uh lean on you for information and for for stuff and you'll

you'll really impact your business uh in a positive manner

Um not to mention that you know when you're doing those hard bid jobs uh you

know and they're pulling for you that doesn't hurt either I mean I got a bid

the other day that said that um it's going to be based on the most responsive bidder too right So asking those

questions making sure you're getting clarifications saying "Hey this is what you should use because this product

probably isn't going to work out because I mean architects are awesome but

they're not right all the time." And we've all seen it where it's like man this is the wrong product But I've gone

through a project recently where it was like it was it was the wrong stuff And then it's like man it's just not

performing I think we should just pull it out put something else there and they were like "Yes I agree." And then and

those are the conversations that you have to have Don't be scared to say it That's where it starts too You know that

real good relationship starts when you can save them You might show them something that'll save them a little bit

of money but be more appropriate for their project Man they'll love you forever for that kind of thing And even

if it's not saving money but it's saving a headache down the road right Like nobody wants a project and to to to come

back with egg on their face Everybody wants to everybody wants to put forth the best possible finished product when

they are walking away And sometimes it's like hey you know what You told me it wasn't going to perform We've installed

this elsewhere Um and we haven't had issues but we're having issues now What

changed And that's where Daniel nerds out too and lets them know hey this is water soluble this we can't use it here

This is what could potentially happen Do you really want to take that chance Yeah this one they didn't even complain about it I did because I didn't like the way

it looked after I went back and to and looked at it I'm like this this ain't it Like I don't want my name on it

Yeah What what what are some particulars about that one Daniel That one it was

just um on paper everything added up to the right amount like where it it was

okay Okay It was like transitions and stuff right And it's like okay we're doing some rubber It on paper it says

that it'll fit in there I mean we could probably only squeeze a sixeenth of an inch in there And it was like

hard So I was like "Yeah it's this ain't going to work." And then while we're

doing it I mean we couldn't just stop and and try and figure it out then right

I was like "You know what we'll we'll do our best and see what happens And it just didn't didn't perform the way I

wanted it to So I was like "Hey let's uh let's change these out." Yeah

And that's where you make note of that right You got to make mental notes of that If you ever come across it again you're going to say "Hey look we've

already tried that I know that the dimensions say it's gonna work but all it takes is for one form to be off or

just it for it to hook down just a little bit too much too much pressure wrong material and it's going to lift it

up just enough for it not to bond properly And like you were saying sometimes you can save them some money too right And

they everyone likes that right makes everyone look better especially when you can go back to the client and be like

"Hey we can use this same exact stuff with a different name on it for this

much cheaper same performance and everything." And that's kind of what I'm in the middle of right now on one where

it's like they're selling the same exact adhesive because you have to buy it with

the product but one manufacturer is selling it for $672 a pale The other one $220 a pale

Dang You know that fancy label costs a lot of money to make

Yeah That's a whole thing like it's not it's not that you're

always saving money by driving You can save them money and increase your margins That's the other thing with it

that I enjoy is I can give them sometimes just by doing a little bit of

research or or having good knowledge of product lines I can show them a better

product more affordable I mean like a real winwinwin I can save them a little

bit of money I can make some extra margin and they get a a higher performing product So we keep we keep

our eyes open for that kind of thing because it does set you out to be the

you know quote unquote industry expert And when when you get that when you've become that to your A

andd community um or even just a few uh firms like I said earlier you'll you'll

see a a it's it's a really uh it's just a different business model but it it

bodess very well to just add it on to your to your current model if you are a

flooring contractor if you're a flooring installer We talked about that a few podcasts ago how you can get involved

with the a uh the A andd community and and work with directly with your u you

know Yeah And the crazy thing is is that a lot I don't want to say a lot of times but if you're working directly with them

they can get the product from the reps based on their relationship with them

sometimes right And and I think um like when you are dealing with architects and you are like

swapping out materials and stuff as an installer I never thought about it has to have the same exact specs and wear

layers and all this but they want to see it has to be equivalent or better in order for them to kind of make that

decision Yeah You know it's funny you say that too because I I had a scenario where we

actually found a better product for a lesser dollar amount from a local

distributor versus um let's just say one of the bigger names Um and I was like

what How can this be like like But he's right it worked And uh the spec got

changed and uh we saved I didn't just make a little more on the margin but we actually saved the clients some money

too I made a little we we made a little bit more and we saved uh some money at the end of the day and and that was a

win-win Um and then the next that's the winwinwin Yeah And then that then the

next ones were just a phone call Hey I need some numbers I need you to start in a month and a half It's like how how often do you guys

do voluntary alternates uh on any project where it's like part of the bid

but you just give a voluntary alternate for another product It's it's had more and more um some of the the hard bids

over here it'll straight up say no alternates allowed and then you're just you're just stuck right And then when um

I I've had a few of them come across plenty of that a lot of it is just basis of design That's when it's like okay

like that that floor that I was talking about with the adhesive just the price of that adhesive I'm like I need to

submit something else because this is crazy Yeah

Yeah And there's there's um there's a lot to be said Like I I've kind of beaten a dead horse here but when you

when you are working with them it's I've I've hard bid so many jobs and

to get an architect or a designer to change their mind on something in a hard bid scenario seems like it's almost

impossible where if you're working kind of directly with them they're so it's so like open And this is that's why I love

specifying product I love working with them I love figuring it out and specifying product because they're so

much more open to your opinion I have a job right now product got discontinued

trying to get them find some material that's going to and it's like the

architects out of Kansas City projects in another part of Kansas like they they

don't even want to hear it there's like well you got to find something You got to find it And I'm like so I've been

searching all over the US for you know for this product and every distributor that distributes that manufacturer I

won't name any names but at the end of the day you know it's like it's so much harder I guess at the end is what I'm

getting at then when you're dealing directly with the person who's making that design decision And I and I think

that I know what manufacturer you're talking about because there's been I was

in a a meeting that we're supposed to start and I was like "Guys that they won't even give me a date like and they

said "Switch it." Like "Don't even care Just switch it Do it right now." Yeah They've been having some problems this

particular one Yeah Yeah And that's why it's good to sit in a room full of

uh I don't want to say it like like that but sitting in a room full of people who have had issues before and they just

want to avoid it They will say that very quickly Yeah Yep Get rid of it Switch it Nothing

you can do about it Um you know I wanted to add to you had said something about uh the alternates and you know at first

uh getting into the bidding and all that and and submitting alternates like I never thought about it uh in this aspect

but now I'm learning and I think it's from talking with you and obvious learning from the podcast and and Daniel

and learning whole thing is if you are switching and submitting alternate you

don't necessarily have to find something totally different you can call uh the same rep and say

"Hey what can we do?" So that way I'm not taking it away from you right Because you don't want to interfere with

that relationship either Yeah If they specified something though a lot of

times that'll come up when it's over budget or something and they're like "Hey could you you know it's this has to

be value engineered." And uh it's a fancy word for get cheaper

you know Um the truth is is I always if somebody has a spec I'm

going to go back to that person unless I don't like them which is pretty

rare But if I don't like the the the rep or the product then I I may not go back

to it and and honor their respect But 99% of the time I'm going to go back to

that manufacturer's rep and I'm going to say "Hey I got to value engineer this

What do you have that's close that's going to you know make a difference here?" Um you know a different line

because sometimes they they have and now with tariffs it's even getting a little more interesting because they may have a

line that they're buying that's subject to tariffs now because it's coming out of Vietnam or something Of course this

is all fluid by the uh you know now it's I don't know that the tariffs are coming out of Vietnam but you get my point

Um and but they have another line that they make down in Georgia that that they can

you know get faster uh that they're pulling out of their own plant that has a little bit different uh

visual maybe but meets the meets gets closer to their

budget And that's when you get to the design aspect I think because a lot of the times they're like just the same

color palette That's what we're That's what we're we need They don't care who

it's from or anything as long as it's the same color palette and around the same size

Yeah And and that's where it all starts That's where this design stuff kind of starts is at the uh that that's kind of

the first introduction I had to it anyway was like hey we need something

that's going to just look good with it Well then you're trying to figure out like what does look good with it

you know you you've got to come up with that what that means So yeah

I don't mind making suggestions when it comes to color schemes right Like I feel like I've been around long enough to see

what what flows Uh but when it's at the end of the day you still want someone

else to sign off on it Like hey this is what I recommend But it's really up to you I I'm not a designer I just I just

been around for a little bit and this is what I am seeing together right Um and

that goes commercial residential I really don't like to be the one to make

a final decision on some a place where I'm not going to live and see every day But well and speaking of residential

like Stud's working with designer Jorge's on here a lot In fact I think he

chimed in earlier and he said "What's up brother right now?" Yeah but

um you know he he's always dealing with the local designers and that's something

that any of the installers out there need to pay attention to is working with them uh working with the uh the design

community a lot of them uh especially in the residential world they buy the materials themselves and you're just

installing them And that was where I first got started in designers Uh there's a company here that's now the

both uh principles have uh retired so they shut it down but at the time it was

called Olsen and Blackburn and I did their work for many many years when I first started this company and installed

it and that's how I got into like learning about that stuff and working with designers was just installing for

them and they were buying their product direct from you know they may go to a pro sourcer or whatever and or they may

be buying direct on some really unique carpet Um so and I know Jorge does a ton of

that stuff So yeah that's what he was saying that you know sometimes he gives he gave him a good price and then you

start a relationship and anytime they make changes they're just like "We don't want any of this extra carpet you just

keep it." And then that gives him an opportunity to go sell it later He says that some of them are like 12 by 30 foot

12 x 50 foot I mean you're looking at a an entire bedroom at that point

or a flat Yeah 12 by 30 1250 Yeah that you can do a lot of uh runners

I know he does a lot of stair runners and and binds the edges and does all that kind of cool stuff but yeah you got

to get involved with those with the you don't have to I mean you can be a bid shop or just a low bid installer

as well but I think there's a lot more pleasure in it You can tell when you talk to Jorge how much he he you know

that he wouldn't do it any other way You know he wants to deal in that world and

customs It's got to be custom 100% custom Yep But that's where they he

brings to the table the ability to do that as well as I know his his input is

is valuable as well And again that's just being the kind of the go-to source for them

What's your guys's um Oh go ahead What do you guys ever deal with uh with

um GC's when they're doing a um they they have their own architectural firm

or their own designers within the GC A lot Really You got a lot of that up

there We don't have a lot of that a lot of our general contractors you know they're still dealing with architects

you know exterior firms I should say What's that So they have a new scenario for you too And it's I mean it's new to

me Um and I didn't really know how to approach it and

but I don't I'm not going to say any names but there was a design firm Yeah Be careful There's a design firm who

happens to own a flooring company Uh and it's like

a sister company Yes I know a GC firm that up in Kansas City

that owns a flooring company and then still solicits bids Yeah And

um I got a phone call and I I I didn't know how to handle this I don't even know if it was the right way to be

honest with you Like I tried to call them like hey like uh I don't know how to appro like I really this is a first

right and uh I got a phone call and they're like hey I noticed that you opened it up or you guys going to put a

bid and I said absolutely not and this is why you know I I just conflict of

interest Are are they not bidding it and I know that they specified it

Therefore I'm not like we said earlier you you you're doing the job for that

salesperson So they're going to give you Yep preferential pricing I mean there's

a few times when I'm on the other side of that that you're talking about where I'm on the other side I know somebody

else specified it and you there's those times because I

like it when it happens to me if I don't participate on the other side and go ahead and just send in a bid even though

I know for a fact I'm not going to get the job that you know that it it causes

this chaos like then they don't want to work with foreign companies to specify projects

and product because they can't get enough competitive they can't get any competitive bidding

So you know you also got to be really careful to keep it somewhat quiet if you are working on a

spec You got to let your reps know but you better be dealing with good reps I have had it to where I was I decided to

spec someone in and I hadn't done business with them in a while They turned around and called my competitor

let them know that I'm working that there's some big job with this XYZ carpet Mhm Yeah that is definitely 100%

already happened to me too early on And it's like you already they already get

the favorable treatment You know what I mean And uh um you know I want to go back to that other conversation part of

the conversation is I did call the rep and the rep said

"Yeah they expect that they're they're going to get the lead." And I said "Okay." Uh but they did make like they

did say something that is true It doesn't matter if they are owners of a

company or a separate entity It's no different than uh a designer calling me

to help with a spec and giving them um information to to give them the right lead right Except for

it's it's a little different Not two separate companies right It's one is

it's one pretty much But the cherry on top is uh guess what still won the bid

Oh yeah Um being very honest and saying what I didn't like and

I don't know if that was it or they just did it like oh you better just give them that one like oh we don't Well sometimes you'll find that you get on the lucky

side of that deal and they're like we've got to award some work I had a contractor I definitely will not name

names but I did almost everything And he started running into problems with

getting competitive bids because people were like "Ah Steuart's going to do it." And so they they they were having

problems because I did all their negotiated work and I did most of their bid work that if something went out for

bid and they were um it was a competitive bid on the GC side too that

they weren't getting competitive numbers from everybody Um and so it was just

like my number If I wasn't low with the other GC's then the other GC's had a a

competitive advantage So there's been a few times where you know he called me and said "Hey man I've

got to give this one to somebody else I've got to or else I'm never gonna

never gonna get another uh I'm never gonna get another competitive bid I'm like hey and even if that was that's uh

that was the reasoning for for us being awarded the project I'm okay with that It shut me up You got

it It doesn't matter I mean they got a good bid on it It's It didn't didn't

hurt you know that it happened that way I mean that's that's just also I do encourage you if you're if you

guys um you know the more you can I I did a um do some educational uh uh stuff

with architects So I've got this presentation called the chemistry of flooring and I just go to architects and

do a presentation on the chemistry of flooring like what to be thoughtful of

from concrete moisture to the different mitigation systems A lot of what we're going to be going over with Huddle U you

know uh for any for all you listeners out there we're going to be doing a new the teaser We're going to be doing new

series coming up soon and uh you'll get a whole different feel of the huddle

It's it's a very particular on particular items Uh it's going to be more webinar um kind of

setup and um experts will be brought in and we're going to be doing some you

know education uh series Uh but when you do those kinds of things and I did I do

these presentations with the architects they really appreciate it to learn what to look for on the back of the LBT B um

spec so that they can understand like they don't understand a lot of times

what to look for in a quality product and so dimensional stability testing and those kinds of things I'm like if they

don't publish it then you you make sure you call and ask for it and it should be at this number or below uh as your

dimensional stability uh it needs to come out of these regions because these regions have really poor raw materials

So if you go in these regions when you're specifying your LBT you're going to have better luck with gapping and

curling and those kinds of issues Um of course I always push them to

Americanmade but so much LBT is imported that you got to also tell them the different parts of the world that are

best to get LBT from And um at the end of the day they super appreciate your

get just free transfer of knowledge and before you know it they're going to call you to ask you what LVT to use in this

scenario or what to use here what product because they look at you as the expert

Well and it's direct information right Like it's uh you're not just reading a spec and

learning from that is you're getting you're getting feedback from from someone who's been out there installing

it touching it has experience with the successes and the failures Um and

through the progression of the technology that's been incorporated in all the materials like you've been there

since I don't want to say ground zero I know you're not that old but you know you're you're up on it right You're

you keep yourself educated to the current time um as best as you can and

that helps Yeah I I I don't make a lot of qualms about it I do look at myself as an expert and you guys do too right I

mean so just lay it out there and let them know that we are the experts in this industry like not just from a um

you know we you can have somebody and this is what I'll tell an architect like you can have somebody that'll sell you

something What I'm going to sell you is the right thing I'm going to tell you what the right thing is give you some

options there I'm going to take this whole vast you know you could fill

showrooms with an S full of product I'm going to narrow that down and give you

the options that best serve your project Um no different than really what we're

doing with Go Carrera Like we're going to narrow down the installers to the ones that fit you uh and your project

the best and give that to you Um so yeah I'm I I think it's invaluable

if you can do those kind of educational things for your commercial uh people but

also Yeah I would guess I've never done this with in the residential world but

if you're a really good installer write up a chemistry of flooring or you know

pros and cons you know something to do with sub subfloors or substrates in your area Obviously these things change

throughout You might in our area you're always almost always going to have a wood subfloor Um unless you're doing a

basement but you know picking the right flooring for your house what are the you

know tricks of the trade or whatever write up something and and offer to to

present that free and you'd be you'll be blown away

at the uh at the um response you get from the A and D community if you'll

give them some free information because a lot of these people are just right out of college You know they get new

designers right out of college and and they know what looks pretty and they're they know how to put things together

that look good But putting the pro getting the right product for the right area and saving them from failures

um and egg on their face they they will appreciate that Got to make everybody

look good man Uhhuh Yeah Um and that's

the key I want I want to ask a question I mean I I know the answer and I kind of

have an idea but for some of the audience out there um you know mostly like the installer base who might not

uh know where to get familiar with additional products and what's out there

What's one of the most effective ways that you have found to get your eyes and your hands on new product that might

outperform what you're used to and what you've been comfortable with for years

Well from an installer's perspective what what I would suggest is when you

get your hands on a good product that goes down good and then you see it you know a few months later and it still

looks good like take note of that stuff you know because that if you

forget you know that's lost But if you if you can take note of that then that's

one way is you're you're taking note of the product that you put your hands on and you know perform well And then next

time you're asked about your opinion about a good LBT you can boom just drop the drop that

bit of knowledge on like hey I just did a project of you know a whole house in this particular product and it looks

just like wood You walk on it and it it feel even feels like wood It's really

awesome And then if you got a few pictures to back it up there you go I mean those are those because you know a

lot of times I mean that's one way The other way is if the architects is

spending time you know they they want to know that you know what you're doing So spending time in researching the product

lines and getting to know sales reps and stuff like that I know there's not as much opportunity for installers to at

least here to get to know sales reps But you certainly bring the knowledge The

more training you take the more you know demos you go to workshops you go to you

start to learn about the products and really understanding them then you are able to uh you know guide your architect

guide your designer guide your homeowner in a good quality decision And they appreciate that stuff man so much

Some of our best letters of recommendation are letters when we were involved in the early going of the job

and and helped lead the way for them to get the right product and they and they

love it On top of that they actually love the product They just Well you're the hero

Um have you have you ever had uh an instance where you're not the hero and

you recommended something because the other product wasn't going to work and this product that that was selected

at the end of the day still did not perform Um there's a twist at the end of

this question That's why that's why I'm just you know I I I can't say that there's been there there's certainly been some

times and I won't name the product that I took a a early designed product in and

then later on it started having some issues not on my project but at this

school district that I took it into and they made it their standard and then there were some issues later on in

manufacturing and quite a bit of it had to be replaced Um that but that egg never came back on

me because it ended up being a different flooring company that did the job Uh the particular one but it wasn't them I to

be fair they're my competitor I'd love to say it was their fault It it was it was it was definitely a product failure

but it it was their fault for using bad product but I did take it in and um you know it

is a good product they just had some manufacturing problems So getting getting you I don't know how you get

around that one You know sometimes even manufacturers make mistakes and um more

so than I think the that the claims even will uh will um uh you know admit

So so the the twist at the end of uh of the question was is yeah it's has

happened It's happened to to me right It's happened We've we've invested um a

lot of dollars and cents in specific products that didn't necessarily perform the way we thought they were going to

Like when we did the little test run and tried it out you know we're time is the true test run right You got to give it

time Um but the other thing that has caused some failures

is not sharing proper maintenance uh with clients and end users and um

that and and then in turn it's you installed it wrong You did this wrong Well you're right It doesn't look good

anymore You're right Now let me try to figure out what's happen Well just give me a second Let me check it out What are

you cleaning this with How are you cleaning it Well the same way I clean that floor over there same way I've been

cleaning the the hard tile or same way I've been cleaning the the carpet Like oh

um yeah I mean that that brings up a deal where uh adding value at the end of

your job doing a little bit of a um a show and tell So one one thing

that what I want to do better here uh at the flooring company at Stewart

Associates is start on our closeouts is do and we've done this but we just don't

do it consistently enough Uh but show them how to maintain Give them a free seminar at the end of the job Takes you

an hour Oh man Oh man And you you show them how to properly maintain it even if

they're going to have like a a janitorial firm maintain it you're like

"Hey I want to set you up for success and and make sure you know how to do it." So uh one time we teamed up with

the local maintenance company went through the exact processes with the

with them before we went to the job made sure that they understood exactly what had to be done and then they

demonstrated it perfectly And uh we just did that to give the owner the best I

mean at the end of the day you're just trying to help them you know and they appreciate that and that'll always come

back to you And uh just showing them the right way to take care of it I've got a

horror story I think I've told on this podcast before We did a big job where we were replacing LBT and we ended up going

in with a one of the early runners in the uh floating floor world Uh it's been

over a decade ago And uh it was a full floating floor over a VCT floor

And about 6 months after we did the job

contractor calls and says "Hey man you got to go out and look at this It is there's something wrong Like really

wrong You got to look at this and I need you to take care of things like take

care of it as soon as possible." I said "All right." So I You sound like

a a computer

Uh oh battery dying I was back Sorry about that

Uh so I went out and took a look at it and uh sorry if this whitewashes my face

guys but um I went out and took a look at the at the

project and uh it was cupped everywhere So bad that the the tongue groove had

broken Um it was in bad shape So I sat there and ate lunch uh and waited It was

great on the floor right Great on the floor It looked great at first for sure So I

sat there and watched them clean it and I noticed this water when they brought it out in the mop was like steaming hot

So I went and talked to the maintenance guy I was like "Hey what do you got in there?" He's like "Just water." And I was like "Oh yeah how do you get the

floor clean?" He's like "My secret dude." And I'm like "Really What's secret?" And he's like "I get water out

of the boiler and it's so hot that it just takes

anything off." off and I'm like "All right there you go." You know he was

taking 212 degree like boiling water No that that's when you just start

and dunking it and just mopping the floor And of course it's taking that

floating floor through this thermosycle that is just unattain it's it it can't

withstand it And so yeah we end up replacing it and then telling them like

the more you can at the end tell them exactly what

um yeah good old Steven water will cause havoc on the carpet too sometimes on

anything We've been on that side on the carpet side where they've they're having issues we go repair it and then he he

ended up talking to the maintenance guy and he was like "Yeah like after you installed it some employees spilled some

stuff on it and we steam cleaned it like the next day after you guys were done here." Yeah Because they had a Yeah I

remember that I was like "Yeah and you add that much heat to that to the backing systems of carpet tile." Boom

This was broad and broad I mean you can break loose you add that much heat to a

broad loom you can break loose that freaking uh latex you know binder to the

secondary backing especially if they don't move the steamer fast enough because those steam

cleaners are intended on going across the the carpet fiber very quickly Uh you

know they get in sit there and and and uh steam the crap out of it and before

you know it the latex is breaking loose And what are you glued to the secondary backing The secondary backing is

attached with latex Yep And that's what happened We had wrinkles everywhere And it's like what

is going what did first I will say first is what did I do wrong Right What did I

do wrong Like I know I didn't stretch it that much I know I didn't manipulate it that much Like what's going on And start

looking I'm like man this looks like this is like water damage or something

And you know this is years ago but it sticks with you And that was the thing is seen the maintenance guy and I seen

him looking at me like and you know you keep your cool and go have a casual conversation Hey man what's going on How

long you been here It's a good place to work Yeah I'm just here trying to fix this carpet I think we did something wrong I don't know really know what's

going on but I just got to get it fixed so that way they get off my back Uh you know it's like you know did anybody

spill anything over here Like it's just really weird And that's when the story came out you know

Yep What was your what was your name again Well we got a few comments about uh

steaming on LVT They'll remove the factory finish Yeah I mean you you got

to be careful with they have manufacturers that all of them have maintenance recommendations for for each

flooring And so going and doing that little display

for their cleaning people will just make you look not only make you look good at the time but it's going to possibly save

you from a call back later when it's a maintenance related issue and not even your deal right and we did a a vets's

office and he was like you know he contacted me hey um what do we need to

do to clean this because we're trying and the only thing that was working that they found was they were taking tennis

balls and scrubbing it right And and I said I said you know I already sent you

the stuff I'll send it over again I said I we even have a I don't know if you have a auto scrubber but we have one

here I can bring it over there and we can you know do that that first initial cleaning just so you can see what it is and he was like "Nope I got enough

information I'll get one." Uh Clint here he's one of our project

managers and he came from the maintenance world and about a couple months back I can't remember the exact

time frame but it's been a few months back he had a customer call and said "Man we can't keep this this floor clean

at all." He's like "It's just gnarly looking Something's wrong with it." He

goes out there He's like "What are you cleaning this with?" Oh this cleaner over you know here And

he goes in they take him in there to their maintenance closet and they were using a degreaser and putting in their

auto scrubber Yeah And putting in their auto scrubber and

uh you could imagine So he gave him a neutral pH

cleaner right out of their own um closet He's like "Here use

this doing work for that client today." And all he did was go out there address a problem and and guide him in the right

way So yeah there's a lot to be said for that We we got off the topic of you know

working with architects and designers but you can only beat that so far like well and and it it it's the education

aspect of giving them all these things right Because you you look at closeouts and they want all this documentation

anyways doesn't mean that anyone's going to read it So the more information that you can put in front of

them at that time the is better Yeah good point

All right guys Well we have come to the end Actually a little bit over on this podcast amazingly uh got started a

little bit uh late so I think that's why um we didn't notice That being said

thanks everybody for joining us Uh give us a like and subscribe on YouTube any of the uh social medias thumbs up thumbs

down We'd love it Uh give us some of your recommendations Uh we are I think

we have our educational series all lined out Uh that be on the lookout for that

We would love for you to attend We really need you to attend If you like the huddle you're going to love the the

uh the educational series We're bringing in experts that will help uh all of us

be better uh at our projects at our jobs and uh hopefully end up you know giving

the clients a better outcome at the end of the day So let us let us know you know what you guys want to know too I

mean the what what we think is valuable isn't necessarily what you guys think is

valuable so we need that input as well Yep Yeah Give us some feedback and uh we

look forward to seeing you guys next week Until then everybody say stay safe and uh we'll catch you next week Thank

you everyone See you guys