The Huddle - Episode 137 - Flooring Forward – Elevating Installation to a Premiere Trade

Are you ready to see the future of the flooring industry? In this week's episode of The Huddle, we’re excited to welcome Ralph from CFI. Join us as Ralph shares insights from his new role at CFI and discusses his bold vision for transforming flooring into a premier trade in construction.

Why Tune In?

Fresh Perspective: Learn about Ralph’s innovative strategies to elevate the installation industry.

Industry Insights: Discover what it takes to position flooring as a leading trade in the competitive construction market.

Actionable Takeaways: Gain tips and strategies that can help you drive forward progress in your own projects and business.

Don’t miss this forward-thinking conversation that’s set to inspire and redefine the future of flooring.

The Huddle Podcast is where the flooring industry comes together to connect, learn, and thrive! Recognized as the #1 podcast in the flooring community, we provide an unmatched platform for professionals to discuss everything from installation techniques to industry trends.

At The Huddle, we’re all about driving Forward Progress—empowering seasoned installers, contractors, and flooring enthusiasts to grow, innovate, and lead in their craft. Whether you’re looking for real conversations, actionable insights, or inspiration to take your career to the next level, The Huddle is your home for real discussions that matter.

Want to be a guest on The Huddle? Email forwardprogress@thehuddle.team

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welcome back to the Huddle your weekly Playbook helping you gain forward progress in your flooring career we're

here to help you win for our new viewers welcome to the team that was that was Flawless no

actually that was bumbled dog I didn't Bumble it enough though what's up

everybody how's it welcome back everyone this week our

topic is elevating flooring installation as a pre Premier trade with me as always

Mr Daniel Gonzalez and Jose Gonzalez I usually say the Gonzalez Brothers today

we have a very special guest Mr Ralph alavina from CFI Ralph welcome to the team my man

what's up today guys this is this is number two right I mean so this is the second many

come it's cool to see behind the scenes like you you don't really realize all the work that goes into these things but

anyway I'm excited to be here thank you guys for for having me

yeah yeah I'm super stoked that um I'm super stoked to have you on for

this episode we got a lot of we got a lot of uh you know meat on this topic uh

we talk about these types of things every week how do we uh you know Elevate

the installer how do we Elevate the trade but really you know if we're wanting to to cure a lot of the the

ailments in our industry to um solve a lot of the problems it really

comes down to how can we Elevate the flooring installation community and the

trade that that skill set to a premier trade I've mentioned this a lot in the

past on uh episodes but you know the n CA has a guy um and his name is Mark

he's one of the lead trainers over there I think he might be the head trainer he told he he often tells a story but I I

remember this story where I don't know if his grandfather or his father uh but

they used to go on to the job sites with like like a tie and a a a work suit

almost and when the flooring or in particular back then it was a lot of hard surface stuff and obviously uh the

ntca being on the hard surface side of the industry um it was Masons and tile

Setters and but with the tile the flooring the marble guys when they got

there it was like get out of the way the premier trade was here there like so much respect for it um I I never

experien those days in my installation career but uh yeah that was that's a story that rides with me I wonder how we

can get close to that so that's what that Topic's about um I was going to start off with

some introductions maybe a little bit of background about uh you Ralph and would love for you to kick us off here tell us

a bit about um who you are like how love

the how did you get in floor story from everybody because they're they're always so fascinating and all so similar um and

then you know where where this this industry's led you

and what what maybe excite you today yeah no absolutely so I see Jimmy put a

comment in there so Jimmy five Hammer rating guy right is that five Hammer

that that is right Jimmy is a five Hammer guy there's only I think we're

about to to Christen the third or fourth here so that's awesome yeah um in in

carpet uh you know interesting quick note we have Z5 hammers in uh resilient

or hard tile yet and but we do have three in uh in

carpet we have some high Hammer rated guys but yeah so Kudos again to Jimmy

it's weird it's weird for the carpet and the resilient though right because there's a lot more training on carpet than there is

resilient resilience tougher especially since the manufacturers have stopped a

lot of them stopped doing their certifications uh that kind of stuff they want to you know there's still some

out there but uh tile though kind of surprises me there's there's quite a few

you know tile trainings and there's a lot more workshops and things like that in tile that are recognized in the

algorithm like the ntca workshops and such are are recognized in the algorithm so uh I would assume there'd be more

Tile Guys with higher with with some with some fives out there but so Ralph tell us a bit about uh about your origin

story into Flor Orin I love it are unique stories right but I'm second

generation and uh my brother my uncle my dad they were all carpet guys and uh

really till this day I mean you kind of never really leave flooring I try to leave it a few times and I got sucked back

in you know we're in need of good talent there's a vacuum over here so once we

get somebody man they ain't leaving no it's hard to leave but uh but it's a good industry it's been really good for

my family and I've been blessed right I mean it it's it I created a lot of financial wealth being in flooring

there's so much opportunity and I'm I'm very thankful to being involved and being in the position I'm in today but

kind of my journey started out as a carpet installer with my dad and um at

that time I got married real young and I had my daughter my daughter is 25 years old by the way she's uh in her fifth

year of college she's got six she's GNA have six years total so very expensive

holy moly yeah but um you know I I started with my dad and it was a great

way to make at that time this was in early 2000s $800 to $1,000 a week my dad

was paying me that was good money back then and um I really enjoyed it and I

started doing carpet even at a younger age with my uncle I'd go as a helper at

13 14 years old so by the time I got into it full-time I could pretty much SE

anything so at 18 years old I was already seaming I was already doing stairs I mean I I already passed the

helper stage so it worked out really good for me and I just always wanted to

do something else and I saw carpet as a a difficult it's very difficult to do

carpet especially because of the weight and and we worked up in New Jersey and you know winter times with carpet there

was those things are hard to move yeah and we we were doing a lot of basement

and in the basements you know you got we had these these dealers that were selling felt a synthetic pad with a

softback carpet Berber carpet that's a disaster and we had to install it so it

it wasn't it wasn't an easy job let's just say that but um I enjoyed it I did it well but I wanted to get into hard

surface and and really what opened my eyes to a hard surface was the amount of align of flooring that was going down

and how quickly they can go into a job site and finish two three rooms alamin it my dad and I are doing a living room

dining room with a patterned carpet and the other guys are packing their tools and we're still there working and we're

getting paid by the yard and these guys are getting paid by the foot I mean do the math

right I told my dad at the time I was like Dad I wanna I want to start doing hard surface let's let's invest in that

and let's get another truck and that's when he gave me the opportunity to kind of part ways he's like son look I like

my carpet I don't want to do anything else I'm happy with what I'm doing why don't you go do that and it's okay I'll

get me someone else to help and that's when we kind of split ways and I started doing hard surface and it kind of

exploded from there it really didn't stop I mean I did every category of flooring I managed a work room in

Louisiana we had about 253 Crews working a day it was a massive operation um we

covered the entire state of Louisiana at that time and I have some experiences in

retail as well so I had a retail store I was aligned with uh Shaw Industries at

that time and uh it it was just a a great business I had a lot of uh you

know when they say don't put all your EG eggs in one basket I had a lot of eggs in this one specific basket and I

remember my growth Journey with this company basically I would I was working

for just a few locations and you know the opportunities kept coming to me they're like hey we want you to cover

this four more stores and then we want you to be a regional player and I'm like okay hey we're gonna give you the whole

state so now I'm like this massive Regional player and meanwhile I I lost

sight that there's other companies out there that are much larger than me and I was just setting the stage for them the

whole time but that's okay that's the way business is right so we uh we we

lost our contract with this large National um Home Center I don't want to

call their name out so I think that's unprofessional but anyways but they

again I made a ton of money there but you know I I met a lot of people during that time and then I told my wife we'll

just we'll just start all over again let's start from scratch we can build this thing again and and just change our mindset right

well I had some relationships with some folks in manufacturing and that's when I shifted to manufacturing they came to me

and they're like hey we would you be interested in this job we need help when it comes to accessories sundies

specifically and we need somebody with an installer mindset to help our sales team Drive sales with accessories and I

talked to my wife I was like hey what do you think of this and she's like hey this is this sounds pretty good

there's benefits there's 401K what the heck is 401K

401 is that a marathon I don't run you know I don't run what is this that means a oh you're gonna match my retirement

great I don't know what a retirement retirement to me is you know just put money in a bank and And maybe invest in

in real estate or something so it was different it was a different experience but I I spent eight years of my career

with manufacturing I learned so much about that other side of the world right so I've been exposed into I've been

exposed to manufacturing retail um installation workroom and as an

installer myself so well versed in in the industry

so so tell tell me real quick how how did you end up at CFI and give us your

title there so I'm the uh new Executive Vice President of

CFI it's it's it's a little fancy title but just call me Ralph the VP of CFI

it's fine but um you know I was actually out of I was getting out of the business again right I was like you know what

we're going to do something else so I had an opportunity with a friend of mine who's a dear friend of mine still and he

wanted to sell his company in Florida so it's a flooring store I was going to buy his company from him it's very very good

business he's got there and we couldn't figure out timing so initially we had a

time set but he needed two more years and then it just just I was like I can't

wait two years I just I need this now and I got some money to put into this I

need to do this now so anyways we we decided not to do that and we actually

acquired a uh company in restoration so I vested interest in a Restoration company and um it's currently in

operations now so that's a uh it's a business that's self-sufficient I have

Ops managers I have technicians so for the most part really my goal is to focus

on the development side and relationships there and I'll tell you it's it's it's interesting because that

business the water restoration business is so it's very similar to ours right we

we cross paths a lot and there's a lot of opportunity for for flooring guys and for restoration guys to work a little

bit closer with each other especially when networking so anyways that's uh

that's another venture but that that was my out of the industry and then this

opportunity with CFI I saw this and I know some of those folks there and I know that you know it's not a it's not

an easy job to fill to lead CFI number one you gota you got to understand the

installer base so you know not everyone does and I feel like I do a good job

with the installers and and I can earn their respect and I'm earning their respect already and it's it's one thing

to walk the walk but to talk to talk right you got to be able to show them that you can do it and I can then you

also got to know how to run a business and that's another box that I

checked there right so there's a lot of boxes that I checked and I felt that I wanted to stay connected with the industry and do something positive and

really CFI kind of they showed me that road map of how to do that and I'm

excited to be here I mean there's look guys there's a ton of work it's not g to be an easy Journey but it's an exciting

journey and it's one that's going to be very advantageous to the industry right this is something we need obviously I

wouldn't be on this this podcast now if it's not important we know how important this is so

amen yeah well we're glad you're you're at the helm we're getting getting a

little chance here to get to know you a little bit more we hung out with you in Vegas at Ty that was great by the

way that was uh that that was a fun time um but

great for you to be on well you know you would not be the first one to have a beer on the podcast no said hodad loves

beer so um yeah so we're we're excited that

cfi's got some dedicated uh leadership in that position uh I knew Steve I know

Steve and he was he was running uh the show there obviously before hand but um

you know Steve was spread thin as H tell you and you know had a lot of different duties and so kind of a that dedicated

Vision um and somebody able to uh create a vision from an installer mindset I

think is uh pretty cool what's up Jesus uh so you know real quick guys

give us your you know background and how you got into

flooring go let start start with whoever well so I started in um I think it was

the summer of eth grade as a one day temporary and did it every summer and

every break since and like I graduated on Wednesday and started full-time on

that following Monday yeah baby it just sucks you in man the industry

does nice that's that's the quick version for sure give me your ver give

me your uh story there Jose uh my brother-in-law at the time uh said

they needed some help for a couple weeks uh and I was like of course and I at the

time I just quit my job as a as a cook at a restaurant I was like looking for

work anyway I was like of course two weeks two turned into two months two months two years two years turned into

27 years now nice holy smokes has it really been that long must have yeah

basically like 50 years basically 5050 years in in FL in floor

years Well mine's you know it's it's funny I you hear the the stuff um my

son's second generation I'm first generation but uh I got in just right

after I got back from boot camp uh for the National Guard and uh was looking

for a job all I'd ever done is bust down tires and in high school my mom was a bookkeeper at some

flooring store and they needed a Helper and I went and been a helper I thought that was going to be temporary I too

tried to get out of the industry uh I I started driving a truck for Nabisco and

my glorious brother wrote tickets on my license and got me fired

oh right back to floring I went at uh 19 years old so I was um I've been in it

every ever since I essentially got out of high school and got back from boot camp and uh I took to it quickly I

really took to to carpet in particular really quickly and it was it was just in

my blood so to speak and next thing you know you know I'm I'm uh four years

later I'm starting my sub business and then we started a full service business

and you know I bought my partner out and now we employ uh W2 uh in-house employee

installers and we also sub out uh to about 70 to 80 subcontractors

so that's that's the story and there's parallels in all of that one thing that

I didn't hear was I got out of college and I went to this great

training uh got started uh I wanted to learn about this awesome industry I'd

heard about and got you know went through a five-week course uh got on a

website uh got hired by a really good guy continued my career got certified uh

in year three or four and then and so that's that is what I feel like is kind

of missing in most stories that started in the 90s or even 80s you get back in

the 60s and 70s and they start talking about well I joined the union floring union they put me through training and

you you do hear those stories from really Old-Timers but newer newer guys

say 90s 90s uh start U I don't hear that story and that's what we're trying to

bring back here with the Huddle is to bring and I know that's CFI and what CFI

wants to do uh is bring back that like the the the origin story being hey

there's this great industry I can go get trained in I wanted to to get into a trade I picked Flor and I went through

some training got hired continued on got certified started

my own business and then you know that that story uh I'm waiting to hear I know

there's people out there that did it that way it's just very few and far between right and you have St here you

have people like Rin that have been installing for 180 years already so he's been through

everything he has he's one of the newest five hammers I owe him a picture so we

can get him him put out there so he's the newest five Hammer uh and he's he's

maybe there's there's one level uh for anybody not knowing but there is one

level above five Hammers and that's just a five plus and that's a certain uh deal

that our algorithm kind of kicks out and it's like maxed out and so when that

algorithm max out we we call it a five plus so yeah Rin might be our first five

plus so five Hammer guys out there there's still one more little to get but

uh so that's the background you obviously are at CFI to make a change

and to do some positive uh things to the industry as as we talked about

earlier and I wanted to give you an opportunity to tell us like what does

that look like for you what what is you know what are the biggest challenges

that you're facing in the in as you take over in this organization and uh what's the biggest

challenges facing the organization and and because of that it's really facing

the industry because I know I'm on the board of CFI uh these two guys have been very involved with CFI for a long time

uh that is what CFI wants to do is like improve the industry so yeah so so our

biggest so I'd say challenge but opportunity at the same time so think about opportunities that we get day in

day out we don't have a shortage of demand there they're out there our issue

is prioritization which ones should we pursue and which ones should we not

because we can't be everything to everybody so and I hate to say that because I don't want to be negative but

in reality is if we're just trying to chase every opportunity that's out there

and we're not bringing any of the ones to the finish line and we're really not doing anything right we we gotta do a

better job priori priori priori prior

prioritizing excuse me it's this kambucha I'm drinking here it's it's throwing me off but um that that's something that

we're challenged with and our team is and look we have good people in our core team right I think jenz on here Jen

Jen's a what she does she works like there's no tomorrow John as well and

Dave I mean the whole team is out there making it happen so it's my responsibility really to to add some

efficiencies to our processes right that's that's something that we're challenged in that we need to fix that

are that that really impede our success because really what I see for CFI is a

way of creating transformative growth we have the ability of doing that but we need alignment within our team and

defined responsibilities right so I mean if we're trying to do everything for everyone

and and that's not going to get us to the Finish Line right so let's let's look at our opportunities let's create

some strategic planning and tasks and and also accountability who's

responsible for these responsibilities right who's got the ball on it and you

know that's going to take some change you know we're going to go through some changes and and nobody really likes

changes but I'll tell you what all the successful companies they change and we have to as well we have to do things a a

little bit different and for the most part I think the team has been open to that and there's more to come guys look

this is month two so so it's it's fairly new I'm still I'm still meeting a bunch

of our stakeholders and people and understanding the organization and and

where we need to be more effective but the good thing is there's opportunity right we just need to do a better job of

prior priority prior prioritizing we gotta come up with a

different word for you yeah that that's a t you know I'll tell you guys that it's I

think it's a little bit of the Portuguese and and the Spanish and you know some of that just all that mixed

up geez

Levi but uh anyway so that that's something there that that uh it's going

to take a little bit of work but we got a good plan behind it and and as long as the team is open to change it's going to

be good change so that's the change part I want to add to that um and I'm going to butt

in the change part is always hard for people right because they don't look as it it when you say change you're changing what they're used to doing when

it when it should be uh Improvement right we're improving we're improving um

there's other words and changes hard for me as Daniel I don't want to learn how to do that I can't I don't want to learn

why I already know how to do it this way but NOP we we had to change quite a

bit and I think it's weird right like with us too because I'm I'm the

technology guy so I'm always pushing on that that new technology and I think people need to look at the industry at

kind of like technology right it's not going to be the same thing you're not going to do the same things that you were doing 20 years ago so what are we

going to do now that's going to be even better than before and that's where you kind of step in and say hey guys I know

that things have been this way for this long but in order to get something else

out of it you have to change something well I I find that people really want

the result of change uh they they don't want to the

actions of change so that saying that if you do the same thing today that you did

yesterday you you'll get the same thing as you've always gotten or whatever if you do the same thing that you've always

done you'll get the same thing that you've always got same thing as you always gotten yeah I mean it's really

that and our industry it's kind of plagued with that I I can't how many times I've talked to guys and and uh you

know if you compare the the the per unit per rate whether it's uh by the yard by

the hour or by the foot rates that are paid out

today uh the except with the exception of a few products sheet vinyl being one

of them I remember getting paid $7 a yard to put in Flash Cove well uh heat

welded sheet vinyl back in the day and now you know we pay out

18 uh so it's made some good jumps but I also got paid almost three bucks a yard

to lay carpet and there's a lot of carpet layers to laying carpet for 350 a yard uh or three bucks a yard it's the

industry uh and it's the marketplace that forces companies into that deal no

no single company in a given Marketplace can just up their labor rates to high heaven or they'd never get a job so it's

got to be a market or an industry push to change it that's one of the real um

focuses of go Carrera is when the entire installer base come together and demand a certain weight a certain wage based on

their uh their skill ability well now companies have a way to measure that and

pay the higher rated guys higher money and now you can have this elevation of the trade as I like to

say um excuse me but you know I I think that

people have to embrace the change if they want the result of the change so many people just want the result I mean

I got a 15y old kid that does the same thing but it you expect it from your

15year old you know um my daughter uh is

28 and as you get older you realize that you got to change some things so she's much different she gets that you know we

got to make those changes um and I think other Industries have been able to do it

uh a little better than us um and uh I'm excited that we have some

momentum going um it's been a lot of pushing in the industry this podcast has

been here what episode number is this guys 137 I think so 137 weeks

so we we've done two years of of uh two years plus of podcasting and we're we're

seeing that wave change a little bit and you're part of that Ralph and and so it's it's exciting to to see some of

this stuff and you know you're a younger guy you got great energy about you I

witnessed that at Ty it was awesome to hang out with you because you got this great energy about you and so I'm going

to lead that into a question of what is what is has the vision for CFI changed

or if not what tell us the vision and if it's

changed how so or is it just like got a little new fire under

it again back everything's about change right so I I think I think our base is

still the same we just got to understand how we can be more impactful in a shorter time and you know I I see an

opportunity really to you think about when you and I may have touched on this

Paul when we first met our first podcast that we did in Vegas but think about the dealer base and you have a a lot of

different levels of dealers right you have some that focus on property management you got some that focus on

single family new construction then you got commercial houses and then you have retail and you have some retail that

sell Cash and Carry right so they cater to that more of that entry level price

point right of of people coming in for rental property then you have some really high-end dealer base right and those are

focused on selling higher-end Goods so that that is a focus for us right how

do we partner with those dealers that are that value for nfic certification

CFI certification and see the value in trading and education and bring them

something that we can offer and and and think that's really going to help move

Theo especially for the installers because again if if you want to work for these higher end these these dealers

that are probably honestly paying more money than some of the other places and they could probably justify paying it

because of their clientele base so we're helping our CFI installers we're helping

our nfic installers by going those guys and setting up training and a program for them that's effective so that's one

of that's one of our f Focus points right is is to really look for the dealer base as a partner I'm not saying

that we won't Target property management companies you know there's demand everywhere there's need for training and

education every single level but if you look at our immediate installers that are partnered with CFI NFI they do cater

to higher end they do they do work with higher end Goods well and at the end of the day I

mean if you look at the way that flooring goes to Market uh the bottom line line is it goes to

Market through a dealer in most cases and so teaming up with those

dealers is obviously an important move for CFI I do question how do you how I

and I've met with multiple dealers um about this question so I'm

curious of your take how do how do you get the dealer to

make it either mandatory or H how does the dealer enforce that they want a um

an installer base that is highly trained yeah so that that that I think we're

still defining p i mean because everything's subcontractor they're not they're not employees they can't force

can't force them can't but they they can say hey all we're going to do is hire these guys but they have demand tomorrow

and I guarantee you if everybody if the installer said no I'm not going to go spend the money and take the time when

I've been doing this long enough and I know what I'm doing and I know how to do it so the answer is no and if enough of

those guys say no then the dealer is going to still use the guys he knows can

get his job done regardless if depending on what they're

installing right I mean so you're not going to give a job to just anybody you

got your people that you use that are qualified so I I think we have to create

the value to those dealers and we they have to be there's got to be marketing

value too where they're utilizing certification and they're having that

conversation with the end user which is the people walking in the door if I have

a retail store and I have my customers coming in I'm going to let them know I

use certified installers and here here's what that program enta tells and here here's what you're going to get you know

you know most likely they're going to go shop around and they're going to ask the other dealer hey do you guys have

certified installers because now you planted a seed the reality is most are not leading with that so we have to

change their mindset to lead with certification so let's say we create a a

certified dealer firm that's maybe a percentage maybe it's 50% of their

installer base are certified so they become a certified firm give them the tools to glead with that

from a marketing standpoint and that's how you win and they'll see the success there and then

again they'll mandate that but that's also creating a behavior where now the end user that's shopping for floors are

going to go to dealer down the street and ask for these things and then dealer down the street is gonna say Hey how do

I get my guy certified what's going on here right so th those are behavioral changes that we can do that will help us

certify more people bettering our industry but also making that the the a part of that selling

conversation right so I mean it's it's a sales tactic that our dealers should be using and if they start now if they

start that today they're way ahead of most of their competitors same thing with the

installers if I'm a certified installer I'm leading with that conversation because you know that you are a minority

to the installer base because most are not so you need to be leading with that conversation and using that as leverage

when you're when you're when you're trying to close on opportuni so well I

like it I think that uh selling based off of the power of your labor uh I

think I actually did a talk on this at one at one year at Ty that you

leveraging your your skill leveraging your installation skill at your disposal

to sell your flooring to to actually sell the product better that uh when

you're showing a high end piece that you're like and by the way we are the only shop in town that only uses you

know certified guys right and so leveraging that and and letting your

guys sell for you by their by their quality and it not just being a onetoone

interaction between the installer doing a good job that homeowner says oh thank thank you for doing such a good job but

that never gets exposed if the dealer leads with that it's always exposed ask for a testimonial from your from your

end user about the installer and put that face forward I see a lot of testimonials uh from dealers being about

how great the sell staff were or how beautiful the showroom was and the ones

that are about the installers almost aren't there uh or they get buried

they're there there's plenty of them there it's just leading with them or letting those be the that forward-

facing thing that's exciting to me because I think the installer should be elevated myself we have a saying that

you know what's good for the installers is good for the industry so so so Paul just to kind of add add to

that there's there's two other areas that that can be beneficial to that that

dealer base right so you think of of of CFI we're under the umbrella of wfca

right so with fcef with fcits right with these other

other organizations so how do we how do we create some Synergy with within those

companies right so we we have our dealer partners and now FCF is bringing all

these new potential apprentices to the industry

right so is that something that we can share with our dealers that are supportive of CFI giving them the

opportunity to hire these new people that have that are interested in joining the industry right and then the other

thing how do we work on a claims process that how can we be supportive there with

our other organization to support because you know claims are a big deal obviously the dealers that are are are

feeling the pain and suffering of claims it's very costly I think all of us have all experienced that so how can we

create an incentive for them to help with that claims process knowing that we

have that organization now that's a partner of CFI in somewhat the same bill

building right so there's a lot of opportunity we have to really create that I I don't know what it is just yet

Paul we're kind of defining it's in this brain right now and it's coming out but we're going to make something happen that's really going to be impactful to

the the industry right and what Kevin says right here you know we need to get flooring manufacturers promoting and

selling both CFI nfic to dealers how do they do this and you know even Roberts

you know offers an exclusive warranty to people that are certified so it it's

getting that that Bing from the manufacturers yeah it's it's a toughy um

it's a toughy because you have other trade organiz train training organizations out there uh to list a a

single training organization uh gets tough I've been in those

conversations right out in front of everybody and their brother at uh different

conventions um so that's a tough one that's one of the problems that we're solving

is giving the ability uh to to point out your uh your first or to point out the

first part of of what you said with the FCF and for those in the audience who

doesn't who don't know FCF stands for Floor Covering Education Foundation and so they take you know new people out in

the industry uh take in some new blood get them scholar shipped get them

trained and now they're available to hire our program jumpstart puts them out

there to uh allow subcontractors who are the bulk need of

the new uh installers uh give them access to the new trainee so um you know

you got to have some mechanisms there I think you and I've uh chatted a little bit about it but there's a lot deeper we

can go about how technology the technology that we've built um and

allow uh to just put the railways in for CFI to be able to accomplish some of

those key goals that's pretty awesome um yeah so we've talked about a ton in

such a short time I say short time we're in this thing 45 minutes here but uh you

talked about Partnerships you talked about um the vision for

CFI um what's your vision Ralph you uh for the industry not not just Ralph What

would what would the um ideal business setting for the industry

and when I say the industry I'm really speaking like the installation community and how it applies because this is what

we're dealing with yeah I mean I think Kevin kind of touched on it right I mean

it takes a village and it's not just left on the installers or the dealers or

the manufacturers we're all accountable to fix our own problems and I think when

we're at a place where everyone sees the value of training and education all

parties that's when we're firing all cylinders that's when things are really

happening my vision is to get that alignment get that moving forward with everyone and we're making we're making

strides we're it is happening maybe not as fast as we want it but I mean go back

a decade you know I mean we we've come a long way and it's only going to give

better you know some of the things that uh we're doing in in that I'm really excited about so we got some new capital

expenditures and uh one specifically that we allocated funds is for our

website enhancement that's really going to help uh really want I want to highlight the installers that are

supportive of CFI and really do more there on that website and get more out of it and and also work with some of our

partners you know Paul you and I are talking about how do we link go Cur era to that to add more value to the

installer so that's that's a huge opportunity there that I'm excited about

and we'll continue to work on that and then also like the facility so we have our home base in Dalton we have this big

Warehouse that I'm trying to create a training Hub there where we have a several monthly events going on in our

home base and that's having people there resources there but uh right now we're we're doing some renovation and and

actually this past weekend I was installing kitchen cabinets over there we're trying to get our break room done

so the only thing left to do is install some floors and uh we'll be rocking and rolling so we have we have an event

going on in two weeks already and then regarding nfic nfic is a a great

opportunity and a great acquisition that uh we did and it's really going to help

uh us CFI but the whole wfca organization um but we get we want to

create a monthly Cadence of trainings at that facility when we do it at our home base we have all the assets we need

there when we start moving things around it gets costly so we're trying to be very efficient and the Dalton facility

really allows us to do that and be supportive to the manufacturers that are local to us so that's that's a huge

thing that we're doing right now I think it's that adds some Synergy too right

having having a home base like that I think adds this um this VI High

vibration you know like something's going on and in a place where things can

can like be known this you go here you're going to get educated uh like

that Hub it's you see them like union halls Across the Nation where um you

know not quite as as much as you used to back in the back in the day but at the

end of the day you know that's a place where Excellence kind of happens you know and and I I would I would hope the

same for for our home there in Dalton is that it gets it gets kind of recognized

as a hub of excellence and and uh you know you can create that by doing some

more trainings and having more uh fly you know like flyends for you know

having a a bunch of CFI guys come together and do a free training it

doesn't have to be certified just a certificate of completion where you know some of the really high Hammer rated or

highly CFI trained guys do a free training for uh you know a set of new

guys or something just things like that that create a buzz um I think is uh is

awesome and to have that Central Hub at home is is pretty pretty sweet uh I wanted to address one of the comments uh

Chad yes CFI does offer training for cell staff

yeah tation yep did you guys see Rollins comment about Dave's a grandfather now

Dave's a grandpa oh Dave Grandpa

Dave well the way he fell on camera about two years ago during the Huddle I

thought he was a grandpa then I'm just kidding Dave don't beat me up next time you see

me yeah he's he's super excited guys we have a great team at CFI and I'm I'm

honored to work with them and and uh take us to the new chapter

so so it looks like Kevin might be be down there next week

so awesome well go ahead no I'd say Kevin's coming down and they they got

some stuff that they're doing Monday and then we have a three-day stair training

that we're doing um our Union that we have a relationship with and W Coast is coming in for that

so and the cool thing that I mean really if you think about like what we're doing there we're also coordinating

some plant tours at some of our manufacturer Partners so they're they're going to have the ability of going and

and and and they were being they were selective about it they wanted to see a Turf manufacturing plant so guess what

we're going to go see a Turf manufacturing plant so we we have the ability with our Partnerships to make it more impactful where they can see

obviously get some training in education but also they can see how the things are made from an aggregate or the raw

materials right how are these materials made those are that's so impactful so

it's cool to go to m tour for sure yeah the mill tours are are awesome they never get

old well you know when we're you know covering the

topic as broad as elevating What what is the

um the one thing that I should say that makes flooring so complicated and we get

compared to say uh electricians or plumbers or this or that those are um

you know another highly skilled trade what makes our industry so complicated

is the subcontracting the fact that 80 uh one study will tell you 87% of

everything you walk on is done by 1099 subcontracted labor not somebody's

employee and so the lack of controls in that uh make it make it difficult do you

ever see that going away not for it depends on the account

right the dealer it's as in it overall like we're talking floring versus uh

electricians and most of it's the exact opposite

most electricians most of the electrical work done in your home is done by an electrical company who has W2 employees

most of the flooring that's done in your home is done by a flooring company or a flooring store that the general

contractor hired that then Subs out their labor and then that sub May sub out their part of the labor themselves

too so the only the only way that really could change significantly

is is if there's licensing from a federal level that's the only way that

we can and think about it what's the difference between us and Them is you need to have a special license to be

electrician right you need to so so we don't have that and I'll tell you I tell

you Paul with um you know I got my IICRC certification through water restoration

so I did ASD wrt and amrt and

the only in in that industry too I mean it's not it's not an industry that that

certification is something that's required however the insurance companies

the insurance providers are requiring it so they're driving the demand for those certifications so you know like what

Kevin said the manufacturers should have some skin in the game here because they

can help drive that c I'm not saying they're all going to do that and I'm not saying that we could even support the

Demand right now where we're at today but I think if some start implementing or maybe changing some of the verbage to

not required but recommended recommended is a strong word right and that's gonna

that's going to really help drive more demand to certified installers yeah well to address your

your your licensing thing earlier licenses are typically um are from a

government or regulation standpoint we we did a long podcast on this actually or part part of it was on this but um I

mean the bottom line is those licenses are required for for protection risk management and protection and so it's

it's really the resulting damage from your activity so you wire a house wrong that house burns down you know you you

Plum a house uh incorrectly and the resulting damage is not just uh uh the

PPE that broke or the seal that was not made but everything around it is ruined

from the water uh if we miscut and install a bad floor in a kitchen the

only thing affected is that bad floor so there's no resulting damage and thus I

it's my belief that we will never see the light of day of a true regulatory

license um because that's really what they're driven for and why they're in place um I also use a they like in in

the UK our friends over there in the UK that we shoot podcasts with every once in a while uh you know they they have a

uh license that's required for these certain gas Fitters well if you don't

fit that gas line correctly you got an explosion you know and they they feel

the same way there'll never be a licence in uh flooring in the UK one of the more

and they're more heavily regulated in construction stuff but they don't think there'll ever be a license in the UK

required because the resulting damage aspect just is not there for us but do we need one I mean think about

it like that's just what drives it so it's like it's like what drives it

you don't you don't need a license to drive a farm vehicle out on your farm

but you damn sure do to get out on the city streets because the resulting damage of you it's not because you the

the skill itself is so hard to drive it's the resulting damage of going out

on the city street and killing somebody versus just tipping your truck over in a ditch on your

farm so do we need one uh or need the resulting damage to get a license I mean

you just have there there's a lot of ears to bend and and uh uh pressure

to uh uh in a from a from regulating bodies for

that to happen that I I don't see that being important enough to them no one's going to die from it why are they going

to spend their time forcing this industry or this a larger governmental

uh license right Kevin says that he bets if manufacturers give some type of rebate the

dealers to the dealers that use certified installers we'd see a lot more people getting certified and the

manufacturers would have a lot less claims and we just had a a rep in here not long ago that said that even she

seeing that their claims are not being covered and it is I mean everyone goes

back to all right they're going to throw the installer under the bus but I said the fact of the matter is is it typically is the installer because

there's too many people out there that don't know what they're doing or don't

know you know the ins and outs and I said I said they just have to not give the inspectors the chance to even call

out anything there's something there guys there's

absolutely something there that we I like what Kevin has to say about it I think you know this rebate if the

manufacturers did a rebate and they they um uh now how you manage that what level

is it R1 doing an R2 kind of job I mean there's some some issues that would have

to be worked through but I think it's the the right direction uh the huddle starts at 3:00 p.m. Central 4 P.M

Eastern for Mark's question

there yeah I like what Kevin had to say I think those rebates did you see what Chad said here like that um if you know

certifications were required that the amount of claims would be cut by 90% but dealers and manufacturers don't see it

and that's because of when we go back to them just blaming the installer and it always just falls back on us and that's

where us as installers need to see the value like hey I'm protecting myself out here because everything's going to come

back to me and instead of just kind of like complaining that it comes back

to us just know that on the front end and and get ahead of it well we need to practice as an installer as a community

and for all the installers watching live I mean we need to practice the same risk management how do you risk manage you

get trained first off you're going to do a better job but secondly you can prove

that you were trained in the proper manner to install the product so it at least takes away one of the lowest

hanging fruits that claims people will blame an installer it's easy to like

if it blows my mind like if you go to a mechanic and he's not trained at all uh

he's got uh you know a a cherry picker and a tree to pull the engine I mean and

something goes wrong you ain't got nobody to go back to you go to the dealership with ASC Certified people or

or factory trained technicians and now they everybody's

protected in the thing if it got installed in if it if something went wrong with the part it's probably the

part the guy was Factory trained on how to uh do that product and so I feel like

as in we should um you know look at it the

same way as a lot of the other industry looks at it as a as a risk management

tool get yourself trained it's a it's a affordable way to not only increase your

skill and get better but it's also an affordable way we lost lost Daniel for a moment he usually pops back on when that

happens but it's also an affordable way to manage your risk and uh not not just

have the finger pointed at you but if you're highly untrained if I'm a claims person I'm

like you're easy target man Paul it's called

C it's what it's about I mean do do your training and and learn your products but

understand cover your butt or ass I mean can we say ass on here that's what CIA

is I mean do do do those things that you should to protect yourself right I mean

as as an installer there's there resources out there you got to put in the effort right we're here guys we're

here to help and our CFI certification you'll go through the not only just the

installation of the product but you know we we teach off of Standards right we're teaching you what those standards are

and then you also have a Brotherhood of people that are supportive to you and

probably a lot of people AR listening right now live understand that right but the people that don't that need to really

Embrace this because the last thing I want is installers paying for claims and

it may not even be their fault right I mean it may not even be side it could be an environmental issue it could be well

there's a thousand things that could go wrong you're just leaving yourself as an as an easy picking correct you got you

gota you got to make sure you protect yourself guys and and and trust me a lot of I I I I don't want to defend all the

installers there's some jobs out there that are pretty shoddy right so if you're doing terrible work guess what

it's on you but if you did everything right according to the standards and the

guidelines and you have and you're a certified installer that conversation is a little bit different if you're going

to send in a claim you know that you've done your job and you have data and

documentation to back up right because that's what they're going to ask you for did you do a moisture test did you do

this did you acclimate the floor those are things that you should already be prepared to answer have all your ducks

in a row we teach that have your ducks in a row know the Lango

that's a one of the biggest things you'll learn in uh certification is the

vernacular that you're going to be asked whether it's h how do you seal your seam

what kind of seam tape all these kinds of things that you're going to get asked during those uh inspections if you know

how to speak the correct vernacular and do it in the right way you got a better

chance of uh of you know passing the test there you know what I

mean SS don't lie signs don't lie all right so we have come to the end of the

podcast I want to thank everybody for joining us um a special thank you to Ralph for uh

joining us it's been awesome to have you on and get to know you a little bit better man and get let the audience get

to know you a little bit better and a kind of our standard setting here on the Huddle um if you like what you guys uh

hear here and enjoy the conversation enjoy our guest consider giving us a

like And subscribe on one of the channels uh we're on all the podcasting networks as well as YouTube give us some

love and uh We've we've had a few shorts hit almost two million views so uh we're

really excited about some of that growth guys it's all because of you and we really appreciate it you're the reason we do it so uh from here I want to wish

you guys the best for those of you going through uh snow mageddon with me uh you

know stay strong stay warm and keep safe out there uh thanks again for Ralph

joining us gentlemen uh the Gonzalez says thank you so much as always you

guys rock and uh you know are the bro we didn't do nothing well yes I like hear

his story so you know what I mean I wanted to hear everything I took a lot of notes and um

trying to butt in here with some of the stuff I'm finding out but uh no I'd like to hear the story the background and and

the goals I appreciate it yeah for sure and uh also if you're a Spanish speaker

and you're having trouble understanding what I say consider joining uh Jorge on

the Spanish podcast of the Huddle and that is once a month uh I believe it's the every third Tuesday it if you follow

us on our you're going to know all right thanks everybody appreciate you and

until next week we'll catch you later